Making Service the Cornerstone of Your Business - PODCAST TRANSCRIPT

Editor's note: The following is the transcript of a live interview with Zach Carpenter from Jobba and Jeanne Boyd from Boyd Bone Dry. You can read the interview below, listen to the podcast or watch the recording.

Intro: Hello and welcome to this month's RLW Read Listen Watch from Roofers Coffee Shop. My name is Heidi Ellsworth and I am so excited about today's conversation. It is all about making service the cornerstone of your business. And we're not talking about just service and maintenance, which is so important in the top, but we're talking about the service, the customer service that comes with a great service and maintenance program. So we have brought our experts today from Boyd Bone Dry Roofing, Jeanne Boyd and with Zach Carpenter from JOBBA. We're going to have a great conversation about the importance of service today. 

Before we get started, a few housekeeping. This is being recorded and it will be available within 24 to 48 hours. We will have the chat open today, so please tell us where you're at, who you are, tell us a little bit about your company and feel free to ask questions throughout the hour. We want to hear what you have to say. So let's get started. So Zach, we have this right, I'm so happy to say. 

Zach Carpenter: Got it. You're good, you're good. 

Heidi Ellsworth: We are so happy to have you here today. Can you introduce yourself and tell us a little bit about what you do with JOBBA? 

Zach Carpenter: Of course, of course. Thank you, Heidi. Yeah, with JOBBA, so I primarily serve in account management, working with new customers and helping our existing customers on our FCS product line. I was one of the co-founders with my family of that product. So I've been in the industry about 16, going on 17 years, working specifically with commercial roofers to help develop and build out their service department. So I appreciate you taking the invite for me to be on the call today and look forward to some good thought-provoking discussion. 

Heidi Ellsworth: I love it, I love it. And Jeanne, I am so excited to have you on here today. We've been talking about this for a while, so can you introduce yourself, tell us about your company. 

Jeanne Boyd: Sure. I am Jeanne Boyd-Curtis. I am a third generation commercial roofing contractor. Our office is located in Mansfield, Texas and I'm excited to say that our company, Boyd Bone Dry, has been around for 51 years. So April 1st we celebrate our 51st year and that's exciting. And I'm also the president of the Roofing Contractors Association of Texas. 

Zach Carpenter: Impressive. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah, very impressive. That's where we met, Jeanne was at RCAT. And I just loved your show, love what you've done with the association. It's so great. And to have you here with the expertise from your company and Zach with your expertise, this is going to be great. So let's get started. 

Zach Carpenter: Let do it. 

Heidi Ellsworth: I do want to remind everybody one more time the chat is open and I already see folks coming in. Hello everybody. Be sure to let us know who you are, where you're from and be sure to ask questions or make comments, or just applaud whenever you want to throughout the hour. So let's start here. Really what we want to talk about is what good customer service means, what does that mean? And so Jeanne, you do this, your company does this, has done it for over 50 years or 50 years. Tell us a little bit what good customer service means to you. 

Jeanne Boyd: Well, I have to tell you, I learned this from my dad, because my dad has never made a cold call in his life. He hasn't, he's never had to make one. The reason he hasn't is because he's taught me from the go that building relationships is where service is at. It is all about that relationship piece, because people want to do business with people that they trust and people that they like and people that they relate to. And so relationship building is the key and in my opinion, the cornerstone of having a strong service team. And it really is. It's just making those connections, what people have in common with you, building those relationships from there, the reliability, the availability, the consistency of it, all of it is so important. 

I think people spend too much time in trying to sell their company. Don't try to sell your company. You're not trying to sell anybody anything. You're just trying to have a conversation with them, get to know them, find out what their interests are, what are their needs as a business owner, as a property manager, as a homeowner, what do they need and what do they want and expect from you in return? It speaks to my heart, because we have so many long-term relationships with property managers and they're the ones that are going to get the word out to other people to say, "Hey, call them over here at Boyd. Let them see if they can help and assist you," and building that trust with them. Go ahead. 

Heidi Ellsworth: I was just going to say, Jeanne, I think that is so true and really when you take the time to listen to somebody else and what they need, that's all people are looking for in the customer service. I want someone to hear me. 

Zach Carpenter: Well and especially on that front, like you said, everyone spends too much time trying to sell themselves. As I've developed throughout my career, I've found the most effective method for "sales" is to not sell at all. It's exactly like you said, just listen to people, help them solve their problems and bring value and that's good business. The cornerstone of business and maybe not the cornerstone, but an important piece is that everyone's got to win. And so I think that's great. I'm glad to hear that you guys are doing that too, Jeanne. 

Jeanne Boyd: We are. And even, it's funny you even bring that up, Zach, because one of the ways that I got involved with JOBBA in the first place is through relationship. 

Zach Carpenter: Yeah, that's true. 

Jeanne Boyd: Meeting somebody at Western States and he's in California and he's like, "Hey, you got to come over here. Have you met these guys over here?" And it was just a relationship and you guys didn't sell me a thing. It was just, "Hey, let's talk and tell me about your company and what your needs are." And it's the same thing when you're out there in roofing. 

Zach Carpenter: It is. I think it can apply to any business model, because no matter what you do in business, B2C, B2B, however you want to look at, it's still people. You're still dealing with people. And anyone out there that's listening, that's doing sales trainings or all these things, my piece of advice on that is just be the best possible communicator that you can. And there's a reason we have two ears and one mouth, is listen. 

Jeanne Boyd: Yes. And coming to the point here on reliability, show up when you say you're going to. When you say you're going to meet somebody, this whole time I'll give you mom and dad quotes, because I live by my parents [inaudible 00:06:53]. 

Zach Carpenter: I love it, give them all. 

Jeanne Boyd: My mother always said, "A man is only as good as his word." Well, man and woman, or whatever you identify as, but you are only as good as what you say you're going to do. And that's how you build that trust is through the availability, the reliability of just saying, "I'm going to follow through in what I say I'm going to do. I'm going to be there when I say I'm going to be there." And just on reliability, be honest of what you can and can't do. 

Zach Carpenter: Totally. 

Jeanne Boyd: If you go up there and you don't know the answer to a problem that you see in a roof, just say, "I got to come back." 

Zach Carpenter: And I think people respect that transparency better, it's okay. People shy away from the word no because it has such a negative connotation, but I think people appreciate, "No, I don't know that answer and I'm not going to sit here and pretend to for you, but what I will do is commit that I will figure it out for you." And that just goes so long, transparency. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah, I think it's so true. And that reliability that you're talking about, Jeanne. Some people might say, "Well, consistency is kind of the same," but people want that consistency in the relationship. They want to know that every time they see you, they're going to get the same kind of service. 

Jeanne Boyd: Well, I think that the consistency part too falls into it doesn't matter whether you're just doing some flashing work or whether you're doing an entire reroof, every project should be treated the same. And that's what they're looking for. They're looking for no matter the size of the project, for them to be treated the same, for your team, to share the same consistency across the team as far as professionalism goes and just how you communicate. You're communicating the same and your standards are the same and making sure that consistency flows regardless just throughout the entire process of relationships. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah, that's really so true. 

Zach Carpenter: 100%. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Okay, so let's talk about why. I always like to talk about why is this so important and why it's important to build a service-first culture. Because a lot of people are like, you can think of this in so many ways, but, "We do new construction or we do re-roofs and that's our big thing and then we have service." But when you really think service first, it's a couple of different ways as you're looking at that. So Zach, talk to us a little bit about why. Why should contractors really be focused on building a service-first culture? 

Zach Carpenter: 100%. And I find this a lot, a lot of the business we do, just because our software is so heavily ingrained in service and maintenance is I do get a lot of contractors especially that are looking to go from residential into commercial service, or like you said, they're in that new construction, public bid world and they want to find a way out. And I know we have some points here, but when I start to think about that and when I have these discussions with people, ultimately I look at it as being able to gain control over your business and have predictable, reliable revenue. And not putting yourself in a position where lowest price wins and being able to do better business with your clients. 

And I think to our first point in differentiation, that's what'll help set you aside, being able to go get with the customer and sit with them. And not just say, "Oh, you need a new roof," but collaborate in their roof management and meet with them and review their needs and get a good understanding. And then you start talking about maintaining that. And I see a lot of that through maintenance agreements and things of that nature. But ultimately I think that the why is to service your clients better and stand out in the market, but ultimately to give you more control of your business. Like with this topic, Jeanne, what was it with your organization that led you guys into doing service? 

Jeanne Boyd: You know why, it was money. 

Zach Carpenter: Hey, I hear you. It is, it's high margin. 

Jeanne Boyd: It's the profit margin, the profit margin on service work. It's something that doesn't have a whole lot of liability behind it, but that's what got us started. And then just coming back to that relationship piece, you'd go in, you'd do a re-roof. Well, you don't just go in and say, "Okay, I'm done. I'll see you in 15 years when you need another roof." 

Zach Carpenter: Exactly. "Call me if it leaks." 

Jeanne Boyd: Yeah. No, you want to follow up and keep up with them and build that culture of, "I'm going to take care of you from the time I stepped foot on your roof to the time you retire and move on and then I want to meet the property owner after you." 

Zach Carpenter: Exactly. 

Jeanne Boyd: It's my roof now. One of those points is respect the property. This is a long-term investment for people and for business owners and so respect that fact and treat it like that. How you treat your own roof is how you should treat your customer's roof. 

Heidi Ellsworth: And yesterday when we were doing our practice, Jeanne, you added that specifically, respect of the property. I love that, because really that is what good service and maintenance is, is getting up there, checking it twice a year or more, however, whatever needs and really respecting and giving that roofing system life, long-term life because of good health checks. And so it creates that respect, I just thought that was so brilliant when you brought that up. 

Zach Carpenter: And it summarizes the other point so well, is in order to hit all the other things, you can start with such a simple thing of just have respect for the building, it starts there. 

Jeanne Boyd: Yes. Well, that building is taking care of so many things. 

Zach Carpenter: Oh yeah. 

Jeanne Boyd: I think I told you guys that story of being up on a roof with my dad and him just saying to me, "What's the most important part of this roof? What is it?" And I was like, "The membrane." And he's like, "No, it's the people underneath it." 

Zach Carpenter: Dad, I hate these trick questions. 

Jeanne Boyd: He's like, "No, that's why you're here. You need to respect this part of the roof system, yes, but it's because it's protecting those people underneath it." Those people that you have those relationships, those people that are going to call you back because you have that service culture built into your leadership at work and your company. It's beautiful when you think about it, it really is. It gives back in this industry. 

Zach Carpenter: Well and I think an important thing too is at least in listening to you talk through these things, is you can really tell your passion for this. And I think that's why we're also excited to have you as a part of this session is you can just really tell that you're not just saying these things because they're the right things to say, but that you live these things. So just wanted to give you some kudos for that. 

Jeanne Boyd: Thank you. I love it. 

Zach Carpenter: You're welcome. 

Heidi Ellsworth: I love it, I love it. And really it makes sense when you're looking at this, differentiating your business, maintaining the roof, respecting the roof. So I think the thing that comes out of this and what we're talking about, because Jeanne, I love your stories about what your dad said, it's the people underneath. But it takes leadership, it takes this really, this isn't just a just for the service department. This is a company as a whole culture and really understanding those key points on strategies. So Jeanne, I would love for you to share some of those key strategies that you found with your company of fostering that service-first culture. 

Jeanne Boyd: And this is one of the easiest things to do, but it's one of the hardest to remember and lead by example. And that is we have our what we call Monday mashups and it's just a meeting where we come together, we've got everybody, every employee's there and we just talk about why we're here, what we believe in, what our standards are, what's acceptable, what's not acceptable and we just model excellence. Because it does, it starts at the top and you have to be that model. And people are going to start to repeat the words, I hear my, I call my people my employees, our family are [inaudible 00:15:22], repeating what I say because they've heard me say it. So I hear them tell customers that and I'm like, "Oh, they sound just like me." 

Zach Carpenter: I love it. 

Jeanne Boyd: For the most part, it's good. Now, I have had people that have accused me of, "You sound just like your father." I'm like, "[inaudible 00:15:37] woman, I don't know." 

Zach Carpenter: Well, he knew what he was doing, so thank you. 

Jeanne Boyd: And touching on training programs, bringing people in, let your people, I can't think of the quote, but it's make sure your people are trained enough that they can leave but loved enough that they don't want to. 

Zach Carpenter: That's good. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Another nugget, write that down everybody. 

Zach Carpenter: The nuggets, love the nuggets. 

Jeanne Boyd: Let them go to every training they can, whatever, manufacturers out there, plant tours, whatever's there. Educate, educate, educate them and in the process, educate yourself as well. I'm back at school, I'm part of the Future Executive Institute with NRCA and I love it, but it's modeling for my employees that you never know enough. You always need to be learning, you always need to be growing and I have lots of growth ahead of me. But we're constantly sending people for training. We bring people in. When we started to launch JOBBA, it was a lengthy process and we're like, "Okay, I don't know enough. I need help." We brought them in, we brought them to Texas and said, "Come into our office." And it was great because I sat in the training too. Everybody attended the training. 

Zach Carpenter: You led by example. 

Jeanne Boyd: Secretaries up front attended the training. We're like, "This is a whole piece together, we're going to be working together. 

Zach Carpenter: Well, because if the company doesn't have that consistent central messaging and you have your departments working in silos, it's just not sustainable. So it's good. I agree with you 100% in the lead by example and it's good to see you standing up for those values too. Because you're in a position of influence as well, you're on boards and associations and your words carry a lot of weight and you have a lot of influence and reach and so it's nice to be able to hear such a positive messaging. 

Jeanne Boyd: And coming to hiring practices, reflecting core values, the last thing you want to do is hire a new part of your service team and say, "Go service." Nobody wants that. Everybody in life needs a mentor and rotate those mentors. There are mentors for certain times and certain seasons of your life. Same in jobs. There are times that you might get a new guy and he's going to be part of your service crew and you've got him with a partner and a peer, but it's really great when the leader steps up, for me to hire a new crew member and walk that roof with him. Have him hear me talk to other crew members, have him hear me talk to property managers, how do I sell my service team to people? Because he's going to start to reiterate that to the service crews as well, the train the trainer program basically. 

Zach Carpenter: Yeah, we're big on that. 

Heidi Ellsworth: It makes sense and this was another thing that we added as we were talking through all of this, but that professionalism, which really goes back to respecting the roof, respecting your customers, but always bringing professionalism first. I think that is something that in customer service is so important and in giving that service. 

Zach Carpenter: Yeah, absolutely. 

Jeanne Boyd: In my opinion, the professionalism, it's not just in the way that they're speaking to the customer and showing the respect, it's in the way they look, their appearance, their uniforms, all the way down to their tools and their gear. Customers want to know that your people are safe, that they're modeling safe practices. Do they have everything they need to be and look and appear safe? And that's just so important that they understand safety's first up there. And just are they communicating professionally and where's the ownership to it? So make your service believable. 

Heidi Ellsworth: This is so true. And I think that's across everything you do, everything you do is having that, from the person answering the phone to the person out on the roof. Bringing that professionalism in is so important. And really when you're looking at it, encouraging open communication and trust and that's what that does, that professionalism leads to people feeling good. Zach, talk to us a little bit about that, just the importance of that open communication and building trust. 

Zach Carpenter: Absolutely and Jeanne brings up a lot of good points. So if we take back to, like we had said before, leading with excellence. So when you enforce that centralized messaging and if your company has a culture of lead by example, it allows you to be able to trust more. Because you know that the things that are important to you are being represented within your organization. And the lead by example concept I think is so strong, especially in roofing too. We made a couple of examples to let's say service crews that has the lead and then the helper, being able to work with those individuals and teach them, because ego gets in the way in so many things in life. And so when people are on the same page, that you're working towards a unified mission and you're able to take feedback from clients and from other employees and actually implement that real change and the employees see that their leadership is walking the walk and not just talking the talk, I think that goes a really long way. 

Especially in terms of you start to think about accountability. Because these are all great things, but then we have organizations that require the implementation of these concepts and that's hard, is how do you hold people accountable and things like that? What do you find, Jeanne, is one of the biggest things that you guys do within your organization that, one, encourages your people to have an open communication from the understanding that they can trust that their words, their concerns, their questions, whatever it may be, are going to be handled appropriately. Do you guys have any special practices? 

Jeanne Boyd: No. Honestly, it's just being a genuine person. 

Zach Carpenter: Yeah, it goes a long way. 

Jeanne Boyd: It's thinking about people, it really is. It's just that care factor that you matter, you matter and your opinion matters. Coming into this whole open communication and trust and that transparency piece, so Zach, I want to cover when we started with JOBBA. 

Zach Carpenter: Totally. 

Jeanne Boyd: We were really open and honest with our crew and our service team, that, "Hey, this is going to be painful." And I think people, you shell out a whole bunch of money and you think this program's going to come in and it's going to fix all your problems. Software is not going to fix your problem. 

Zach Carpenter: We actually did a webinar on that probably eight months ago that said, "Technology won't fix your people or your process problem," because it's true. 

Jeanne Boyd: Correct. And so we were just very transparent in, "Look, this is going to be slow. It's going to be slow. It's not going to happen in 30 days. It's probably not going to happen in 60 guys. You guys, it might be six months. Oh wait, it might be a year." 

Zach Carpenter: It might. 

Jeanne Boyd: You just don't know, because everybody's coming in at different learning points, different technology points, different backgrounds, different timeframes and just being open and honest, say, "These are the company goals," and then set personal goals for people. I had a personal goal for an employee that was just to check an email every day. 

Zach Carpenter: That's awesome. 

Jeanne Boyd: [inaudible 00:23:29]. 

Zach Carpenter: Yeah, totally. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Good job. 

Zach Carpenter: It makes sense, yeah. Stepping stones. 

Jeanne Boyd: Meet people where they're at and grow them from there. 

Zach Carpenter: Yeah, I always say too, from a management or a leadership standpoint is no one's perfect and it doesn't do anyone any good just trying to highlight people's negatives or things like that. You got to lean into people's strengths and play off their weaknesses. That's how you build and run a strong team is understanding that no one's perfect, people are going to have flaws. Some people don't know how to open Gmail but they're good at other things and you got to leverage that and get the most out of it. And to me, that's strong leadership is where it starts. 

Heidi Ellsworth: And I think... Oh, go ahead Jeanne. 

Jeanne Boyd: I was just going to say, coming back to what you had said, promote your people. So one of the best things in the world, later on, if you hear down the road, Zach, that I'm talking to somebody else and I'm like, "Oh, have you met Zach Carpenter, he's a great guy over at JOBBA?" When that comes back to you, you're going to be like, "Did you hear what Jeanne said about me?" 

Zach Carpenter: Totally, 100%. 

Jeanne Boyd: You're like, "Yeah, that's so cool." 

Zach Carpenter: Yeah, love Jeanne. 

Jeanne Boyd: When my guys are up and they've heard the customer, that, "Oh, you want Tony out there looking at this roof?" And Tony goes out there, they're going to be like, "Oh, you're Tony, I've heard good things about you." 

Zach Carpenter: Totally. And that's going to make Tony have a sense of ownership over that situation or at that property. It's going to elevate his respect for that client, which is hard to do. 

Jeanne Boyd: It is. 

Heidi Ellsworth: And I think everything that you are both saying too and we're talking a lot about the employees, which I think is so important, but you are modeling behavior then on how they're going to talk to your customers, how they're going to talk to the facility managers or the building owners with transparency and honesty of, "You know what, this is going to take a little bit more work. There's a problem here. We're going to have to do some research, some core samples." Those kind of things, Jeanne and even talking about you walking the roof and showing train the trainer, I think that open communication and trust is so important with your customers. 

Zach Carpenter: Well and I think a good summary of even this topic is open communication builds trust in it and that that can be multifaceted and whatever, but at the core of it, I think that's a strong point. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Okay. So to that point, one of the things is having the right tools to be able to have that kind of open, honest communication and build trust. So as we're looking at how technology helps deliver outstanding service and I'm always one, like building owners have to love it when they have a new portal to look at, when they can have all the information right in front of them. So Zach, talk a little bit about how companies, just like you did with Boyd Bone Dry, how do you work with companies to bring in this technology to really help them just amplify their outstanding service? 

Zach Carpenter: Well and so this is an interesting topic and like I said, we want to try and be thought-provoking in these conversations. So when I look at this, I think there's two facets. There's the benefits that the roofing company and or our client gets. Then there's the benefits that their clients get, our customer's customers and I think as long as our customer, the contractor, understands the balance between internal efficiency and efficiency and better communication and the whole package for their client, is where it starts. So we look at the CRM for example. I think it's really important that you have a CRM that directly represents your type of business. What do I mean by that is there's commercial software, there's residential software, there's general contractor software, is one, making sure that you have the right tools in place that support your business model. But then two, we start to look at it on that concept of let's take a commercial-based CRM, a commercial-based CRM and in the definition of a CRM is a customer relationship manager. 

So it's not about using a system to just track all your jobs, that's great, but what you really want and when I do my presentations, I try and tell this part as a joke and it never lands, so I'm just going to say it normal. But these CRMs, what they're effectively doing is helping you build the roof facts for that building. So that if no matter what happens and it really goes back to Jeanne's point of respect the property, is keeping the documentation, tracking the service history, the budgets and having all of that data ultimately available for the building. Buildings change ownership, someone comes in, buys it, whatever, or it gets inherited. But the ability for you guys to retain that data and bring that value to the customer of, "I have the history of your roof in my platform." And so that plays to some of the other benefits the clients receive. 

But in terms of delivering outstanding service from an internal efficiency standpoint, you will never be able to match the speed and efficiency that you can respond to a customer's request and ultimately resolve their problem in a paper and pen to technology comparison. I don't care who they are or how fast you can write, you cannot dispatch a work order and get it in your tech's hands on paper faster than I can look at the schedule, assign it, dispatch it and have them go out there and document it. It's not possible. And when we first started the company FCS and JOBBA back 2008, 2009, we were met with a lot of resistance. That was like iPhone 1, iPhone 3 and it was, "No, our guys are not going to use an iPhone on the roof, that's crazy. You're crazy. They're going to keep using their digital cameras and they're going to come back and download all the pictures and build it in Microsoft Word." And we got our reports. 

Luckily, as the industry has evolved and time has gone on with technology developments, a lot of people understand that now. I'm now met with nowhere near the same level of resistance to technology adoption that I have been in the past. So that is definitely refreshing, but being able to then leverage those items to your customers just to me makes it just such a no brainer, that if you're going into a commercial service and maintenance department and I will promote our company obviously and say JOBBA is a great option, but everybody's different and there's tons of tools. People need to evaluate what's best for them and what meets their needs initially. 

But that's the thing, is understanding that you're going to get those internal efficiencies and benefits, but so are your clients and you need to be able to be aware enough to represent those benefits to your customer. And like Jeanne said, inherently know enough that you realize that the pain of a six-month or a twelve-month implementation is for a reason. So yeah, I think that pretty much sums up what I wanted to say on that particular item, but what do you think about any of that, Jeanne? 

Jeanne Boyd: Zach, what I got out of that is you're really young because- 

Zach Carpenter: Thank you, I take that as a compliment. 

Jeanne Boyd: Well, I have to tell you. Actually, when I started here, we were on Polaroids, the disposable cameras and you would have to wait two weeks to go down to the CVS or the Walgreens, get them printed off and then you'd have to put them down for your clients. And, "I'll get you before and afters and [inaudible 00:31:26]." 

Zach Carpenter: Well, my stepdad actually used to use Polaroids. The digital camera was obviously just [inaudible 00:31:32], you're correct, I am youngish and it was the phase I came in, but he used to use the Polaroids and a glue stick and would glue pictures onto a report. And it worked, it was effective. 

Jeanne Boyd: I got trucking crates of that stuff out here [inaudible 00:31:47]. 

Zach Carpenter: Do you? Oh, that's awesome. 

Jeanne Boyd: Trucking crates of it. But no, it is, it's a process. And I think all our clients understood when we changed CRMs. And I will tell you and I'm not promoting JOBBA, I know everybody does a report here. 

Zach Carpenter: Of course. 

Jeanne Boyd: But one of the things that I did get when we made the switch to JOBBA was it was slower for us because there was a learning curve for our guys and everything like that, but our property managers were like, "I got to tell you, I love the before and after reports you sent out." Because we were getting those right away. Deficiency reports, they were getting those immediately, like 24 hours after we got on the roof, they'd get their deficiency report. And the carrier piece, the carriers loved that. Because they were able to submit that to their insurance company, go, "Look, this is what our roofer just sent us." And they love just having that immediate feedback. The carrier's like, "Well, did they submit an estimate?" "Yes, we'll get that over to you." And just the presentation of that to our clients, they were totally on board. 

Zach Carpenter: Totally. And they're probably more apt to pay the invoices. It's just things we find, the inherent benefits, reduce pay cycles, things like that. 

Jeanne Boyd: Yes, [inaudible 00:33:01] service. 

Zach Carpenter: Yeah, it's awesome. 

Heidi Ellsworth: What you talked about at the beginning totally goes into this, you talked about reliability, availability, consistency, all of that becomes possible when you use technology and have that effectiveness. And I love this last one and Jeanne, I'm sorry, I didn't mean to interrupt you because I got all excited. But when you look at transparency, that's really what you just said. For that facility manager, that business owner, they can go in and they can look at past reports, they can look at current reports, everything. 

Jeanne Boyd: Yes and they really do. They appreciate it. Half the time they don't want to get up on that roof. So especially when it's 120 degrees in Texas, they don't want to do that. 

Zach Carpenter: Exactly. 

Jeanne Boyd: And some of them, I don't want on a roof with me. 

Zach Carpenter: The guys don't even want to go up there at that point, they just have to. 

Jeanne Boyd: [inaudible 00:33:56]. 

Zach Carpenter: Exactly, you have to 

Heidi Ellsworth: Mornings. 

Jeanne Boyd: It's great. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Go ahead, Jeanne. 

Jeanne Boyd: No, I was just going to say, it is, it's all part of delivering that outstanding service to your client, is them being able to see what was on their roof, what deficiency you found. The before and after photos just speak volumes to them. It's the transparency, it's the honesty and especially when you can produce that right down there for them to say, "Hey, let me show you what I just found up there." Golly, they just- 

Zach Carpenter: Right away too. Even if it's only a couple days, a few days, there's not a lag. Because they still have other responsibilities, this is just a facet of their responsibilities of making sure these items are running correctly in terms of a property manager or something like that. But yeah, 100%. I feel like the quicker you can get people the information while it's fresh on their mind, like we said, they're more apt to pay, to approve, to collaborate, I think is the key here, is if I were to take from at least this segment of our discussion, a takeaway for everyone would be collaboration. Is that the key to all of this is the technology will enable you to better collaborate with your client base and everything else follows. 

Heidi Ellsworth: And that then builds trust that they're going to let you onto their next roof or their next building. 

Zach Carpenter: Exactly. 

Heidi Ellsworth: So it all goes together. So okay, Jeanne and you've been through this, you've brought JOBBA on, you are using it effectively and I'm sure you can talk about that. But it seems to me that getting technology as part of your customer service commitment really shines the brightest when there is a problem, when issues arrive. So talk a little bit about how you're using this customer first service, first culture philosophy with technology to deal with issues as they come along. 

Jeanne Boyd: Oh yeah. In so many ways, delivering great service when issues arise, it really is, again, that having the speed to be able to show a client and I'm going to come back to that transparency piece. It happens when you get up there and you go, "I have no idea what I'm looking at." And being able to show them photos of, "Hey, when I was out on your roof when it was dry two weeks ago, this is what your roof looked like. This is your roof today after we've had two weeks of water. The purpose of a roof is to shed water. This roof isn't shedding water. That's what this roof is designed to do. It's not, why is it not? I can't figure it out. You've got the proper number of drains, you got the proper number of scuppers, I don't know." 

They can see it. They then trust that you're honest, that you're open. They see that you actually looked at something, that you know what you looked at. They know that you know what you're talking about. And then you have the ability to say, "Let me bring this back to our experts in our office." Or, "Hey, we may have to consult an engineer on this." Or, "Hey, how long have you had these problems? I've only been on your building for the last six months, did you have these previously?" Well, they're going to automatically see that, "Oh wait, had I been with her for a year, she would've known what my roof looked like six months ago. Hold on. I don't know what my roof looked like six months because I wasn't provided anything." 

So right there, you've sold them on, "This person goes out to roofs and talks to them about six months ago, I bet she can tell her other clients what their roof looked like six months ago." And it is, it's they are going to trust that I'm going to bring that great service to them, that transparency, that openness and honestness, it is all just a piece of that puzzle. 

Zach Carpenter: Because you have the roof facts. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Yes, there you go. Roof facts. 

Zach Carpenter: Trying to make that work. 

Jeanne Boyd: Right in your CRM, exactly. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Well and I think also really when you look at this, by having the ability to look at those past photos, to look at the past inspections, it gives you that opportunity to sit with that facility manager and say, "Let's do some planning. Let's do some planning. We know we get hit with hail every year, big hail storms. What are we doing on your roof? How can we help minimize the damage? What's happening?" And so Jeanne, when you really look at that, that what we are saying here, anticipating the needs, proactive planning, that only comes from having that data and that relationship. 

Jeanne Boyd: And part of that also, we get hail here and storms here and everything else, but part of that proactive plan is also tied into scheduling. Because they need to understand, you need to be able to communicate with them and say, "Hey, I know it's raining and you have a leak right now, but we're going to have to plan to get out there, be proactively out there in three days because I can't go up there when we're expecting torrential, tornadic hurricane-like storms the next day." 

Heidi Ellsworth: We're protecting our people, you have to. 

Jeanne Boyd: Yes, you're going to have to get a trash can for the leaks right now, but communicating that, but being proactive to call them ahead of time in the storm, "Hey, if this leaks," or, "I know we went out there last week, we flashed this. We did what we could. Call me when we're getting these storms next week, call us if it rains, let us know." But still, even though you've told them, "Go ahead and call us," call them ahead of time when those storms hit and go, "I don't know what it's doing in Dallas, but it's pouring over here in Mansfield. Hey, is your roof leaking?" Has that piece [inaudible 00:39:42]? 

Heidi Ellsworth: Being able to collaborate like that, how much easier does it make it to sell preventative maintenance programs. And saying that we know that these storms are expected, we know that these facilities you guys are managing have these problems that already exist and we know we need to come out there once every six months and touch things up. And that sell and again, sell's not the right word, but the ability to get the client on those recurring maintenance programs becomes so much easier when you're collaborating and when you're honest, because it is the right thing to do ultimately. 

Heidi Ellsworth: So true. 

Jeanne Boyd: And it's interesting, because property managers love it. Because when you call a property manager and you say, "Okay, look, I'm going to call you next week because I know we're getting some storms in. I want to know how that northeast corner's doing." When you call and it's raining and you're like, "Okay, it's raining in Mansfield. What's it look like in Dallas? Is it coming down there?" And you're like, "What's that northeast corner of this property look like?" And they're like, "Let me call that tenant because I don't know. They haven't complained yet." It's on their radar. They call that tenant, they look better now to the tenant because they followed up. 

Zach Carpenter: Oh yeah, because they were proactive. 

Jeanne Boyd: Yes. 

Zach Carpenter: It's a win win win. 

Jeanne Boyd: And sometimes it's, "Let me give you the direct number, would you call the tenant and check?" That's fine. Other times they want to be the one, but then that tenant is going to stay with them in that property because they know they're taken care of by the property manager. 

Zach Carpenter: And they lower their guard. Even just like you said, "Will you call the tenant?" In what world are they just going to be like, "Yeah, sure. Call my tenant." It's just not to do it. 

Heidi Ellsworth: When there's trust. 

Zach Carpenter: Exactly. 

Jeanne Boyd: It makes such a difference. And of course- 

Heidi Ellsworth: Trust and answers. 

Jeanne Boyd: [inaudible 00:41:24] stop by, but it is wonderful. And tenants love it too when they can get a photo and say, "Hey, this is the corner that was leaking, could you let know if it's still leaking today?" 

Zach Carpenter: Totally. Well, they feel involved, they feel like they have a say in it. It's not just, "Oh, well, the property manager isn't taking care of it." It's like, "No, you're involved. We're all collaborating." 

Jeanne Boyd: It's a two minute proactive approach, yes. 

Heidi Ellsworth: It makes so much sense, it makes so much sense. I want to remind everybody the chat is open. I know, I'm so engaged too I almost forget telling everybody the chat is open. 

Zach Carpenter: I think everybody's just listening. 

Heidi Ellsworth: I know. So if you have questions, comments, I've seen a couple of claps and hearts go up. Thank you so much. And I also had some nice notes here in the chat saying, "You guys are the best and great content." So just so you know, but please ask questions. And what you were just talking about, about that proactive call to your customer and then possibly to those tenants, it's all about building loyalty and that service first culture that drives brand loyalty. So Zach, let's talk a little bit. Let's keep that discussion going, because that really, I think, makes a huge difference. 

Zach Carpenter: Oh, 100% and I think this segues so well and even just continuing where we were going with that is like we said, that collaboration, so if you're working in a position like that, let's use the example we just used where someone on their team calls and checks in and they say, "Why don't you reach out to the tenant?" That level of trust from that customer. I think the odds of them going and even entertaining other contractors and things at that point just doesn't make sense. You build that loyalty just through the collaboration and working together, almost as if the loyalty, really it should just come as a by-product of doing good business. 

You're going out, you're helping them fix their problems. It's not about pointing blame or anything like that, but again, I think that keyword of collaboration is so strong. And Jeanne, do you guys do anything unique in terms of customer loyalty programs? Because I've always thought of these kind of concepts that could be pretty effective, just curious if you guys have ever implemented anything like that. 

Jeanne Boyd: Just maintaining relationships. 

Zach Carpenter: Yeah, it goes a long way. 

Jeanne Boyd: If you've got a baby, I'll remember to say congratulations next week. It's that type of thing. Of course we have all the swag. We can give you a coffee cup. We got these cool pens that I use in restaurants because I'm blind and they have a little light at the end. I can see the menu. 

Zach Carpenter: 100%. 

Jeanne Boyd: And you've got that stuff that reminds them that you're there. They can go buy that stuff. They don't [inaudible 00:44:30] that stuff, but that piece of relationship is going to be what they're looking for, that branding piece of, "I like those people at Boyd, they're nice. They're kind, they're friendly, they follow through, they care." Listening is building our brand. 

Zach Carpenter: Totally. 

Jeanne Boyd: I can't tell you how many times I will say, we get a leak call. The number one thing you can do is stop and listen and I repeat it back, I'll say, "Hold on, this is important. I'm writing this and I'm a slow writer." 

Zach Carpenter: Let me just make sure I heard you. 

Jeanne Boyd: Let me make sure I have this right. That's how you build that brand loyalty is by showing that you're listening, you care. To them right there, when they have a roof leak, nothing else matters. You can have a four-year-old at the doctor, that's fine and that's [inaudible 00:45:22] time. But to them right now, they've got 16 tenants calling them about roof leaks. 

Zach Carpenter: And it needs to be addressed immediately. 

Jeanne Boyd: If you've got that sick kid then you need to give that to somebody else right then so that client feels they're still the number one important thing. 

Zach Carpenter: Totally. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Yes, no matter what's happening, somebody's there for them. And I love it, because as you put in here, addressing it quickly, owning it and that's really what all goes into it. And I always am like, I want to treat people like I want to be treated. And I think if you think about that, those are the things, what you're saying here, builds loyalty, of everyone makes mistakes, but if you own it and you get back to me and you're open and honest about it, I'm like, "Yeah, let's stay. Let's keep going." 

Zach Carpenter: Let's do it, let's do more. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah. I want to real quick, we have some great comments and a really good question here. 

Zach Carpenter: Totally. 

Heidi Ellsworth: So first, Jason and Aaron both said, "Fantastic content, great reminders for sharing today." But Vanessa, thank you so much. She has just a great question that Jeanne, I think you will be able to answer. If you are first starting your service department and it is small, how do you get started in building that trust or services, especially if you do not have the time initially with multiple properties? 

Jeanne Boyd: Good question, Vanessa. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah. 

Jeanne Boyd: Building that trust when you're small, I am small. Let me give you a peace of mind, but you can do it. That's inappropriate to say size doesn't matter, but it really, really doesn't. Relationships are a one-on-one thing and so no matter the size of your team, you don't want to spread anybody too thin, but you're just duplicating a process. So they're duplicating a process. So whether your service team is one, 20, 20,000, you're teaching them how to duplicate a process team to team, person to person, member to member. And so don't think of it as you're small. And also don't take on too much that you're going to disappoint clients, because you can't build a brand if you're disappointing people. 

Zach Carpenter: Well, it goes back to what we said earlier, it's okay to say no sometimes the right way. 

Jeanne Boyd: Grow at a safe rate. You don't want a massive boom of business all of a sudden that you can't take care of because that is going to hurt your brand. Start out slowly, build that, grow that and make that happen, then do a little bit more. Then do a little bit more and add on a little bit each time to grow that. I hope that answered your question, Vanessa. 

Heidi Ellsworth: And I wanted to add one thing there, because I just heard this at a conference recently, but really focusing on the customers you have. You've done re-roofs, you have customers out there. It's like you said earlier, Jeanne, that's not a cold call. That is somebody you already know who you can talk to about their service programs that you can take care of and it's all right there. It's not like you have to go out and find all these new customers, take care of the ones you have. 

Zach Carpenter: Well, that's actually... Oh, sorry, Jeanne. No, you go and I'll add after. 

Jeanne Boyd: I was going to say, Vanessa, I see you mentioned when you don't have the time. Find the pockets of time. And remember, it can be as simple as an email. It can be a text, but even if you're in the car getting gas, clients appreciate when you're like, "Hey, I just popped in the car. I got to tell you, I'm about to drive through carpool, but I was thinking about your roof today." Or, "I just stopped for gas and I saw this and it reminded me of you guys, just wanted to check in and see if everything's okay." Use the little pockets of time if you're just slammed and you don't have any time. It just takes a few moments to let them know you checked in, even if it just goes to voicemail or you're just voice texting something on a text message, a little pocket at a time goes a long way. 

Zach Carpenter: Yeah, totally. 

Heidi Ellsworth: I love that, "I was thinking about your roof today." That's awesome. 

Zach Carpenter: I'm going to pick up my kids. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah, I know. Vanessa has a follow up. What if the first client is a property management company and the horse has left the stable on a nationwide scale? Well, first of all, congratulations. 

Zach Carpenter: Congratulations, yeah exactly. Number one, good job. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Wow. Thoughts, Zach? You've seen a lot of nationwide company or facility management and contractors working with them. 

Zach Carpenter: Absolutely. That's what I was going to add a minute ago is and I don't know if this is directly related to Vanessa's situation, but I do think we talked about earlier, I do work with a lot of contractors trying to get into this realm. And I feel, like you had said before too, calling your old clients and things, a quick call and introduction like, "Hey, I've been thinking about your roof today." Go out, do that free inspection, do that free assessment and then take that data and sit and collaborate with them. And I think ultimately, Vanessa, especially in trying to operate a service capacity on a nationwide scale, the collaboration is going to be your best friend in terms of making this relationship as effective as possible, is being able to get with them and one, set realistic expectations. Don't bite off that you're going to inspect their buildings across the entire country in the next 60 days. It's not going to happen. 

But tell them, like little pockets of buildings too, "Let's focus on these." But you've got to wow them with the first few. You've got to go out and you have to impress them. And ultimately the goal, like we try and promote with our software too, is once you get those reports and you have the assessment of the condition of the existing property, your goal is to get on the same side of the table as that client. You want to be able to sit down with them and go through that report and say, "Look, this is going to be an issue. This is ultimately what I recommend." And a lot of times not just going for the roof replacement will inadvertently end up getting it for you too. I'm sure you guys have run into that, but it's just to me and I think especially in that position for contractors starting off, is consistency, but then harnessing the power of collaboration is really what's going to take you the furthest. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah, and... Go ahead, Jeanne. 

Jeanne Boyd: Another quote and this one's from my mom. 

Zach Carpenter: Let's do it. 

Jeanne Boyd: [inaudible 00:51:39] can't maintain, because quality control is everything. And if you can't maintain it, you're just going to disappoint somebody. If you can't cook dinner every Tuesday night, don't cook dinner on Tuesdays. 

Zach Carpenter: Yeah, that's true. That's true. 

Heidi Ellsworth: That's so good. And we're going to go, actually, our next topic was on extreme growth, which sounds like what you're having, Vanessa. But before we do that, I have to say this is my favorite comment in the chat overall of all time and that is from Gary Boyd. Thank you. He says, "That's my daughter." It makes me teary. 

Zach Carpenter: So proud. 

Heidi Ellsworth: It took me a while, Gary, to say it, because I get teary over these things. So that was awesome. 

Zach Carpenter: Well, that's awesome. 

Heidi Ellsworth: So okay, let's talk a little bit about, Vanessa led us into this perfect, on maintaining high service standards while scaling, because you've seen a lot of scaling. Jeanne, let's start with you. As you're growing your business with your dad and your mom, talk to us a little bit about what are some effective ways to do that? 

Jeanne Boyd: And actually, it's hard, because I came into a generational company that really we've grown, but it was never my father's intention to be this multi-billion dollar roofing company. His intention was to take care of his family, build it enough, know what your goals are. So dad's goals were to build this company enough that his family was provided for, they had what they needed. We got a couple vacations a year. We didn't have to worry about staying at Motel 6s. We could go at comfortable places that we wanted to stay at and enjoy ourselves and have a comfortable life. That's the goal. 

And so know what your goals are as you're scaling and as you're growing your service standards. If your goal is to be the $20 million company, the $20 billion company, that's a fantastic goal to have. But as you're building and growing, make sure your systems are in place for the next level as you're getting there. Because I'll be honest, JOBBA is a beast of a CRM. It does so much more than we're doing now with it. But we signed on with that intention of, "Hey," because I want to grow a little bit more than my granddaddy did and a little bit more than my dad did and so we signed on knowing this can do more down the road for us. 

Zach Carpenter: You had the long-term commitment, you had the vision. 

Jeanne Boyd: That's how you scale is, look, see the long-term commitment, see your long-term goals and be prepared to grow with that. And along the way, communicate with your people so they know. Because they're going to be intimidated, it's like giving somebody a brand new iPhone that's never used an iPhone. They're like, "Holy smokes, what is this?" 

Zach Carpenter: What is this witchcraft? 

Jeanne Boyd: Yes and you have to be able to say, "Hey, it does a lot of things. It has a lot of apps here. We're just going to use these three right here." 

Zach Carpenter: Right, exactly. 

Jeanne Boyd: Right now we're going to this and then we'll use these other widgets later. 

Zach Carpenter: Right, [inaudible 00:54:47] little wins. 

Jeanne Boyd: Yeah, communicate- 

Heidi Ellsworth: As you grow. 

Jeanne Boyd: And every time I update my iPhone software, it does something new and something cooler. 

Zach Carpenter: Yep, all the time. 

Jeanne Boyd: I learned that you can type "wow," you can make it so it pops "wow" now. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah, I know. It's super awesome. [inaudible 00:55:02]. 

Jeanne Boyd: [inaudible 00:55:02]. Yeah, they're changing too. So let your people know that there's going to be change along the way that happens to what you're already doing. 

Zach Carpenter: Totally. 

Jeanne Boyd: And we're building and growing and scaling with it. 

Zach Carpenter: And leveraging the data too. Our next point is just training and leadership. When I'm meeting with contractors, we have this report in our system where it is just called our service report, but it's KPI metrics on profitability of not only each individual job, but as each encompassing, what I would call service buckets, your service types, T&M, contract warranty, RTM. But then it also breaks down and provides data on profitability of each crew. And ultimately we do business for money, however you want to look at it, making sure you're hitting your profit margins, but that data enables access to information that you would otherwise not be able to find. 

And what I mean by that is within that report, it breaks out the margin per service crew of their profitability on both individually labor and materials. Without access to that, if they're lacking in their gross margin in labor, maybe they need better training. If they're lacking in materials, maybe they're wasting too many materials. And how else would you know that other than following them around all day? And so it's about leveraging these things and then ultimately data at the end of the day, but I wanted to provide that input on the training and leadership part. 

Heidi Ellsworth: I think that is so true, Zach, exactly what you're saying. It's perfect. And as we've been talking about communications, I can't believe how fast this hour has gone. 

Zach Carpenter: I know, it flew by. 

Heidi Ellsworth: We're going to get to the last one, but I do want to say, Vanessa said, "That is my exact situation, Jeanne, thank you for the guidance." So Jeanne, if put your email in there, if you want to reach out to Jeanne, we always like to network people, or you can always email me, Heidi@rooferscoffeeshop.com and I'll get you introduced. So we're all in this together and this is pretty awesome. So last slide, we only have a little bit of time, but let's just talk about Zach, how? How do you get this information? How do people who want to follow the same path as Jeanne and Boyd Bone Dry, how do they get on the CRM and get involved with JOBBA? 

Zach Carpenter: 100%. Like Heidi said, we love to network and be able to work with and communicate with people. I do all of our intake and presentations and everything. So anyone that is listening that's interested in exploring the technology side and even just wants to have conversations, you should go to our website, JOBBA.com. And you can fill out a form and it'll come right to me and we'll set up a time to do a call and walk through your needs. Other than that, Heidi said the coffee shops and the content that they provide is just an immense level of value. 

Follow them on social, subscribe to their emails, attend these Read Listen and Watches. And then throughout the industry there are individuals that we work with and build with and can introduce you guys to from a consultive type approach. But ultimately it just starts with don't be scared for anyone to reach out. Or even if you feel like, "Oh, these are big companies, we're not ready for that," I can assure you that that is not necessarily true. Everyone has to start somewhere. So if you want to do more with the technology side, feel free to reach out to me. I'll even put my email in the thing too if anyone wants to reach out directly, but if you go to our website, it'll come right to me. But yeah, there's resources. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Yeah, that's what I was going to say. If you could put your contact information in there. Jeanne, real quick. Last thoughts. 

Jeanne Boyd: I'm going to say find mentors and don't be afraid to put yourself out there. Network, network, network. Because again, coming back to accepting responsibility and you don't know what other people know. Well, I might call Heidi and say, "You might have this answer." Heidi's going to say, "I don't have it, but I know who does." Network, network, network. 

Zach Carpenter: And it goes back to even if you don't know, even if you guys have questions that we aren't aware, like we said earlier and like Jeanne just said, we'll help you find out. We all got to work together and I think all of us- 

Jeanne Boyd: There's plenty of roofs. 

Zach Carpenter: Exactly, everybody's got to win and we want to everyone to win. 

Heidi Ellsworth: And I want to say thank you so much to both of you. This has been delightful, so educational. I learned, I always learned from these, so thank you so much for being on today. 

Zach Carpenter: Yeah. 

Jeanne Boyd: Thank you for having us. 

Zach Carpenter: Yes, we really appreciate it. 

Heidi Ellsworth: Thank you all for watching. A special thank you to Gary Boyd, thank you for being on here and making our day. And please check out the JOBBA directory on Roofers Coffee Shop. You can find so much information in there, articles, all kinds of different things on service. We have so much. It's really the trend for the new millennium. This is what you need, your company needs to be there. 

Zach Carpenter: It is. Have to do it. 

Heidi Ellsworth: So thank you so much everybody. We'll see you again next month for the RLW. Have a great day. 

Outro: Thank you, everyone.