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	Vickie the Boss: [ A REAL ROOFER - Forum Topic from November 2003 ] , Monday, June 18, 2012 @ 7:27 PM       TITLE: A “Real Roofer”? Mjkelly78 – I am very new to the roofing business. I have a small construction company and until this weekend I had only been a shingler. This weekend I had my first flat roof experience using 1 inch ISO, and fully adhered EPDM. My father, who is a 35-yer old union roofer showed me how to install the roofing materials properly and says that now I am becoming a “proper roofer”. His thought is that anyone can read a package of shingles and install them good enough. But until you know how to do flat roofs (rubber, built up, etc.) you are not a roofer, you are just a person that can read and follow directions. What do you guys think about that? No offense intended to shinglers, just wondering what your thoughts are. REPLIES: Mike H – Wow, what a potato!!! Every roof requires proper installation, however, it is easier to go to Lowes, buy some shingles and put a roof over your house that will effectively shed water, than to buy membrane and all the accessories, then install a flat roof that will not leak for 20 years. The next question is what about Slate, Tile, Metal, Flat Seam Copper!?!?!? The truth is, they are all junk if done wrong, all good if done right. With all of that said, I don’t think putting down one small runner roof makes anyone a real roofer, any more than changing oil and spark plugs makes someone a mechanic. Good luck as you travel the road of greater knowledge. Mjkelly78 – I totally agree that putting one rubber roof down does not make me a roofer anymore than anyone else. I was asking more about the statement my father made to me about being a real roofer. To be honest, I do not necessarily agree with him, I just wanted to know what you guys thought. Also, I am not trying to offend anyone, and if I have, I apologize. Peter – Hi MJ, I agree with Mike H and I am glad to see that you do too. There is so much to learn about roofing systems and how to fit the best roof to suit your clients needs and budget. One thing you have done (IMHO) that will be of great benefit is calling into this site. There is so much knowledge passed around freely among American Roofers I could almost set up in business out there. However, I’m not so sure everyone would welcome me. BOSS – Yeah Peter, I don’t need any more competition here, stay over there. Hehehe. I think the old man was saying that since you are putting on other kinds of roofs, now you are starting to be a real roofer?!?!?! I don’t know, I could never understand what my father ever said to me either. Twill59 – There is some logic in what he’s saying – if every shingle roof was a straight up ranch with no walls, valleys, chimneys, vent systems, etc. Yeah, then any able-bodied person should be able to pound on some shingles. Also the line seems to blur with the carpentry trade and shingling. Some carpenters are capable shinglers, but can’t comprehend a low slop roof. Egg – Hey Boss, my father said “Son, we’re worried about you.” I understood that part. A “Real Roofer” is one who A) Understands what a roof covering is supposed to do for the building. Understands it well enough to cross over from material to material to make it happen. C) Understands how roof coverings interface with contingent or tangential trades. D) Can do a large amount of work in a sound manner day after day without getting fooled by unusual conditions. E) Knows what will last and what won’t. F) Knows what is inadequate, what’s adequate, what is superior, what is “overkill”, and what is beside the point. G) Knows how to handle low pitched roofs and all the other pushing-the-limits-of-the-envelope details and applications and knows what will have to dealt with before her stumbles onto it and shuts him down. H) Knows that water runs downhill and the check comes on Friday. I) Knows that beer tastes better after hot work than shingling. J) And John Doe 1-100 Egg – And I forgot the most important: Knows not to save the shady part for when the sun moves around and blasts it. Which reminds me, a “Real Roofer” knows where the risks and hardships are and how to manage them. BOSS – I like to think of a “Real Roofer” as an aqua physicist. A “Real Roofer” needs to know water, how it flows, how it moves, and what it could do, and most importantly, how to stop it from doing those things. I think it is something that you are born with, most roofers can’t be taught how water works. Either you get it or you don’t. And those of you that get it know exactly what I mean, those that don’t know what I mean, don’t get it. JSC – Ah, yes – the shady side. I still remember how the guy who was on the shady side took 2 hours to lay a square, especially when two or three of us split the square on the house evenly. Jay – I put on shingles and you can call me what you want to, real roofer or not we are so busy right now putting on shingles I don’t care about titles. I think anyone who works n the flat business or shingle business and puts in a good honest day of work is a REAL ROOFER. GAK – Welcome MJ. A “Real Roofer” learns something every day. None of us knows it all! Egg hits it on the head, as usual. It takes years. I always say that by the time you’re really good, at this trade you’re too old to do it. I started as a shingler at 14 years old in the summer working for my dad. Used to day a day off in high school and pound out 10+ square. I thought I was rich! Dad passed at 42 and I was too young for the business. Ended up in the flat roof union for 12 years and learned a lot. You can never know too much. Now I’m back in the shingle business. I feel like a real roofer, but I’m still learning. Now I am trying to get to where I feel like a “Real Business Man”. Roofing gets in your blood.
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	GKRFG: [ RE: A REAL ROOFER - Forum Topic from November 2003 ] , Monday, June 18, 2012 @ 9:37 PM     I am a : Roofer   8 1/2 years ago! Are there any older examples? Wonder what ever happened to Mjkelly.
	Vickie the Boss: [ RE: A REAL ROOFER - Forum Topic from November 2003 ] , Monday, June 18, 2012 @ 10:03 PM       I'll have to ask Steve. Roofing gets in your blood.
	GKRFG: [ RE: A REAL ROOFER - Forum Topic from November 2003 ] , Monday, June 18, 2012 @ 10:05 PM     I am a : Roofer   So did the forum start at the same time the paper started? Can you remember?
	Vickie the Boss: [ RE: A REAL ROOFER - Forum Topic from November 2003 ] , Monday, June 18, 2012 @ 11:26 PM       No the paper started way before June of 1994 I think. The first website was RoofExpo but no-one tied the two together and no one would go on it. So then we called it RoofExchange and it grew a little bit but not much. Remember I couldn't call it roofers exchange.com because it looks like roofersexchange.com. See the problem? So my friend Heidi came up with the RoofersCoffeeShop idea and we remodeled and the rest is history. Roofing gets in your blood.